Ruth Institute Blog

Just read that Article 16 put out by the UNITED NATIONS. Even the UN in declaring marriage to be a basic civil right recognizes marriage as the union of one man and one woman.

“Every child deserves to begin life with a mother and father. Gay couples cannot provide the family support they need.”

Every child deserves to begin life in the care of responsible, capable, caring adults. Not every child’s mother and father meets that criteria. Many gay couples can. Bigotry is believing that children are automatically worse off with gay parents. Bigotry is ignoring facts and reality because they don’t fit your already preconceived ideas about gays and lesbians and the idea that their relationships aren’t worthy of recognition.

Every child deserves to begin life with a mother and father. Gay couples cannot provide the family support they need.

Just a great blog David as you and I see something very important and similar. Putting the needs of children before selfish sexual adult desires. That wonderfull relationship between father/son, father/daughter. mother/son, mother/daughter which every child deserves to have. Yes due to human tradgedies like what happened on September 11th some children lost their fathers who were fire fighters. But these were not deliberate.
The greedy and extremely selfish homosexuals will deliberately deny a child either a father or mother relationship just to satisfy their sexuall lust for each other. I feel for the poor child who has for example lesbian parents who used artificial reproduction and denied the child their daddy. Daddy is nothing more than a sperm donor. The mental harm that comes to children purposely denied one of the parents.
On the internet saw the sad video of a girl raised by two homosexual men. You see the hurt in here eyes as she described the horrors she had to endure having two homosexual men as parents. There is also a website of children who have learned that Daddy is sperm donor #???. Again I feel their pain.
As you pointed out the true and real bigots are the homosexuals themselves by refusing to recognize the childs point of view and kids rights. As one kid said it in another blog ” did I chose to be denied a loving mother and father?”

@John Noe
“As you pointed out the true and real bigots are the homosexuals themselves by refusing to recognize the childs point of view and kids rights. As one kid said it in another blog ” did I chose to be denied a loving mother and father?””

As the child of an abusive father, my response to that is buck up kiddo, life isn’t fair. During my parents divorce, I cried that I just wanted a “normal” life. Later, upon growing up and maturing, I know that divorce was the best thing that could have happened for my life. Nobody gets to choose their parents. Plenty of kids with unloving mothers and fathers would love to have two loving fathers or two loving mothers, or just one loving parent. I am extremely lucky to have a loving mother and step-father.

Post a link to the “sad video” of the girl who had two gay parents. I’m curious what “horrors” she lived through.

@John Noe:
Your rhetoric doesn’t square with reality.
Apparently you’ve NEVER met gay parents, single or in couples. Especially those who have adopted, and unselfishly opened their hearts and homes up to children who are otherwise unwanted.
In effect, ALL men are sperm donors. The child having a mother and father, is up to whether or not the man wants to PARENT, isn’t it?
Kind of difficult for someone to TAKE his donation from him INVOLUNTARILY, dontcha think?

And as for any young people who had a negative experience in the home of their gay parents, in comparison to kids with hetero parents having the SAME problems, it’s not even a guess as to the overwhelming majority of who that is.
Yeah, I saw that video too.

I work for the police in the crime scene photography unit. Wish I could share with you the HORRORS of children being raised by mom and dad, or in an institution because mom and dad abandoned them.

Even for argument’s sake, you won’t admit that the ability to nurture isn’t bestowed on GROUPS.
But individuals. No hetero person should be assumed to be able to do it, any more than assuming a gay person can’t.
The outcomes, regarding gay or hetero parents who are committed to being good parents, is relatively the same.
With a few exceptions: the children of gay parents have more compassion and are raised in less sexist, racist, anti gay and dispassionate regarding the handicapped than their more insulated counterparts raised by moms and dads. Especially in strict religious homes.
And the children of gay parents tend to go into social justice related professions.
Gay people don’t refuse to recognize a child’s point of view, any more than ANY adult is compelled to. What hetero people are REQUIRED to consider that at any time by law?

It’s a reality that having gay parents who love them, isn’t the worst thing to happen to a child.
Having NO ONE to love you, and who might even abuse them, is.
And there is NO guarantee, that a mom and dad won’t subject their child to either.

“The greedy and extremely selfish homosexuals”

Yes, gays and lesbians are selfish for devoting their lives to raising children, often children who were discarded by irresponsible heterosexuals. It’s interesting, gays and lesbians are called selfish and hedonistic when they live without children and are called greedy and selfish when they decide to bring children into their lives. So thank you, John Noe for following up my post with a perfect example of anti-gay bigotry.

I think I’ll take the “children need a mommy and a daddy!” rhetoric a bit more seriously when the homophobes equally aim their barbs at purposely single parents. It’s funny, the quality of parenting is never a concern when talking about a single parent. I can’t recall one comment online where someone criticizes a single person for parenting alone. Interesting.

And of course, the straight people who eschew their parental obligations are given a pass, so long as their child support payments are current. So I guess one parent + money is as good as a mommy and a daddy!

Nerdygirl the horrors she lived through were the two homosexual men always engaged in sexual relations in the home with multiple men. This is an extremely negative situation to put a child through. Noone should have to go through that. I saw the sadness in her eyes when I saw that video.

I am sorry to hear about your abusive father. But your unfortunate situation does not prove that children do not deserve a loving mother and father. There is no link to your isolated case as proof that same sex parenting is better than Mom/Dad parenting because your one father was bad. That is an insult to the millions of men who are proud to be daddies to their daughter.

There is nothing bigoted about saying that children need a mother and a father. It is the truth and just plain makes biological and common sense. It is what is best for the child. Since when did any child ask to be denied the love of a mother and a father. The poor child had no choice.
Thanks to same sex parenting two of the following wonderfull scenarios and relationships are deliberately denied. The mother/daughter, mother/son, father/son, or father/daughter love is purposely withdrawn. This is so tragic and sad for the children. Appeasing selfish and greedy adult sexual desires over the best interests of children.
If homosexuals really wanted to be true loving parents to their children then they would engage in a one man and one woman marriage. Just imagine two adults having so much love for their children that they put aside their sexual desires to instead do what is best for their children. But the homosexuals refuse to give their children this unconditional love. It is not because they can’t but because they will not. They put the convience and selfish sexual interests over the interests of what is best for their children.

This is why they are selfish, greedy, and self centered. They really are not devoting their lives to their children. They proved this when they refused to give the child the mom and dad that they deserve. Oh it can be done. I saw a blog of a rabbi in Israel marrying homosexual men to homosexual woman. They wanted their children to experience a mother and a father.

So my rheteric does square with reality.

Every child deserves a mother and a father. Which is why we expressly demand that parents can never divorce once they have children, and single motherhood is against the law.

Wait…

@Roivas : Every child deserves a mother and a father. Which is why we expressly demand that parents can never divorce once they have children, and single motherhood is against the law.

In other words, we need better policies to protect the right of children to have both a father and mother.

We don’t need another policy that would deprive children of that right.

While it sounds like you did not intend it, you made a great point against against divorce, unmarried sex, and same sex marriage all in one brief comment!

@John Noe
I don’t think that has to do with them being gay so much as it has to do with them not being discreet. I.e. I’m pretty sure a child who had indiscreet swinger parents would be hurt by their actions to.

You’re example is invalid because it wasn’t that they were gay, it’s that they had lots of indiscreet sex. Indiscreet sex is not something inherently gay. You’re example, which you’re not backing up a link to, is just as isolated as mine.

My father is an insult to all the good fathers out there, not me pointing out that men like my father exist, not me pointing out that many children, with fathers like mine or bad mothers or no bio parents would love two loving parents, even if they are the same gender.

“There is nothing bigoted about saying that children need a mother and a father.”

It is, because it’s factually incorrect. Explain what you mean by “need” and how the lack of a mother or father creates a problem. What evidence is there that a lack of a mother and a father in the home ensures a problematic childhood. Did you notice that we have a president who is the product of a fatherless home? Ever notice that some biological parents, though living together under the same roof and even married, are lousy parents?

Sorry Nerdygirl but my example is valid. Homosexuals are known not to practice monogamy. They openly have sexual relations with many partners. So called same sex marriage does not change that. Go read the views of Dan Savage for example. This girls incident was not an isolated one but one that happens a lot.

A biological father and a biological mother are required to create a child. That is factually correct. The question is why should we sever the link of either the biological father or the biological mother with their creation or encourage the severing of that link?

Even if the biological father is hopelessly unworthy, he should still be linked to the extent that he should be saddled with financial responsibility, i.e. child support payments or bastardy payments. To sever that link would be to create a moral hazard.

Children can be quite resilient. They can survive all sorts of abuse and sometimes turn out well. That doesn’t mean we should normalize abuse or ignore the considerable evidence that every historical society that has come down to the present day has found the traditional nuclear family to be the best way to organize families. See also Murphy v. Ramsey in which the SCOTUS declared that the traditional family was “the sure foundation of all that is stable and noble in our civilization.” I am sure the court knew of families that had lousy parents, but they nevertheless so ruled.

@John Noe
You’re not backing it up with a link or source, just a “video you saw”, You’re not taking into account that the majority of people with multiple partners and kids LEARN HOW TO HAVE SEX WITHOUT THE KIDS KNOWING, and that Dan Savage is not end-all-be-all of gay people, and has a large STRAIGHT following. (I do read Dan Savage, I read him weekly, I am well aware of his views, and screwing-multiple-people-that-your-kid-knows-about-or-can-hear is not one of them) and you’re not citing anything for the claim this “incident happens alot”. This is weak, and it smells of prejudice and stereotype. I mean really, this is bad. This is high-school-freshman-school-paper-op-ed bad.

“A biological father and a biological mother are required to create a child. That is factually correct. The question is why should we sever the link of either the biological father or the biological mother with their creation or encourage the severing of that link?”

We all know how babies are made. We’re talking about parenting here. This sudden concern for children’s parenting needs seems focused on gay couples, but not single parents and incompetent straight couple parents. Why?

@Leo
“A biological father and a biological mother are required to create a child. That is factually correct. ”

No Leo, that’s not correct. The fact is that scientists have created children from two mothers and no father, and two fathers and a chimera mother, in other species, and they could do the same thing to make a human child. Also, SCNT cloning could be used, and adult stem cell technologies too. Nothing is stopping them legally or technically, they are only waiting until the technology is more reliable, for their PR. They don’t want to do something objectionable and get it banned, and they want to make sure the idea that it is a right has time to sink in and control the debate.

@Sean
“We’re talking about parenting here.”

Parenting is only tangentially related to marrige, Sean. You don’t need to be married to be a parent, and marriages aren’t required to parent kids, nor do they even have a right to parent kids.

Contrast that with conception of offspring, which is the essential right of marriage and can’t be taken away (or shouldn’t be, anyway! That’s the challenge we are facing now).

No Nerdygirl my evidence is not weak but quite factual about what goes on in the majority of same sex couples homes. My post was not strerotype but the factual truth about what is really going on.

As far as being prejudiced. Remember it is okay to discriminate against evil and immoral behavior which is what homosexauality is. It is okay to be prejudiced in favor of what is best for children. Children do indeed need a mother and father.

@John Noe
You provide no link to this evidence. No link, no title to this video you (supposedly) saw, no studies or statistics to the other (stereotyped) information you provided. Dude, I’ve heard stoners make and back up more coherent arguments then what you are proposing.

Stereotype without proof = prejudice.

If you have the facts for those allegations, back it up, otherwise admit you don’t have the actual info and retract it like a man.

I do have the facts, the video I saw on the Internet was real, the info is correct so I am backing up my statements like a man.

@John Noe
THEN POST A LINK AND LET EVERYONE ELSE IN ON THE BIG SECRET.

If you don’t CITE YOUR SOURCES, there’s no way for anyone to VERIFY it. Thus it looks like you’re pulling the information out your butt. If you can’t back it up, by citing your sources (like they teach high-school freshman to do) and posting links you’ve got nothing. (Certainly there’s a joke to be said for how well men follow directions here)